The Hobbit: Into The Fire (A Purist Edition of Desolation of Smaug)

[ranger613]

Hi guys,

I just completed "Into the Fire". This is the second Desolation of Smaug edit I worked on-- the first is called "Fire of the Dragon" and the thread is here: http://www.fanedit.org/forums/showt...ire-of-the-Dragon-(Desolation-of-Smaug-Recut)

Why a second cut, and how different from the first?

Well, "Dragon" is my preferred version of the movie, where I cut out all the extra made-up-for-the movie padding that stretched a perfectly good 2 hour movie into almost three. Dragon was a version that didn't drag and had good pacing, and is what I feel the Theatrical cut should have been--I emphasize that because a lot of the material I liked from the actual movie and I felt made it entertaining (namely, the barrel fight and the dragon showdown in the end) are left intact in Dragon-- I just felt those made the movie more fun and gave it the feel of adventure it needed.

However, I strongly agree with a lot of the criticism of both Desolation and my first cut, in that these things (1) were a little over-the-top at times, and (2) never happened in the book. So since "Dragon" got decent preliminary reviews in terms of A/V as well as cutting, I decided to go ahead and make ffurther changes to produce a "purist cut" of the movie. Instead of just being a watered down version of "Dragon", I trimmed more, reordered certain scenes, and made a new opening for it, as well as a new title.

This cut has none of the zany dwarven antics of previous cuts and is strongly faithful to the novel (if you overlook Legolas, and Bard being a bargeman). It is different enough from my first cut that I felt comfortable giving it its own release-- Dragon is 120 min (41 min cut) , Into the Fire is 98 min (63 min cut). This is a version I hope fans of the novel will enjoy, and is in many ways a better movie than "Dragon", narrative-wise.

Title: The Hobbit: Into the Fire
Original runtime: 161 min
Fanedit runtime: 98 min

Cutlist Changes from Fire of the Dragon:
1. New intro involving the eagle rescue from An Unexpected Journey
2. All Kili's interaction with tauriel outside of the spider battle is cut
3. Barrel sequence recut to exclude dwarf antics/ over-the-top legolas action
4. Secret Doorway sequence recut to delete sequence of dwarves giving up and abandoning Bilbo
5. Smaug sequence recut to exclude dwarves ever entering Erebor, and no molten gold
6. Color correction applied at various places to match up spliced shots
7. I see fire reinstated as end credit song, and disclaimer slide added.


Cutlist (from Fire of the Dragon):
1. The prologue with Gandalf and Thorin in Bree is deleted.
2. Other than a brief scene of him chasing them, all the scenes of Azog and Bolg (the orcs) stalking the dwarves as well of the scene of them at Dol Guldur is deleted
3. Bilbo being tempted by the ring outside Mirkwood forest is cut (this isn't LOTR)
4. Legolas' Gimli reference is cut
5. Entire scene of Tauriel and Kili, and Tauriel with Thranduil is deleted. There is no love triangle.
6. Shots of orcs ceeping up on Mirkwood are cut, making the orc attack more of a surprise.
7. Gandalf at the Nazgul tombs trimmed-- cut the lines "You're asking me to abandon my friends, etc."
8. Kili's arrow to knee is bound and never spoken of again. He's all better in this version.
9. Cut scene of Legolas & co interrogating an orc, as well as Bolg tracking dwarves.
10. Trimmed Laketown scenes for pacing.
11. Cut all scenes of the four dwarves being left behind. Cut all scenes of Tauriel/Legolas (after the Mirkwood battle.)
12. Cut all scenes of Orcs attacking Laketown.
13. Gandalf vs Sauron, is kept in, but moved to before Bilbo enters Smaugs lair.
14. Entire Smaug sequence intact in one flow, except a brief cutaway for about 30 seconds where Bard tells his kids he'll kill the dragon and grabs the black arrow.
15. Cut scenes of Bard running around Lake town and getting arrested.
16. Cut Bilbo's last lines "What have we done". Last lines now Smaug's.
17. The end credits scored with Misty Mountins Cold from An Unexpected Journey.

Samples:

Thanks guys. I hope to release this close to Fire of the Dragon so you have a choice of which version you prefer to watch, depending on what you liked from the theatrical version.

Update 6/24:
Thank you all for the positive feedback for "Fire of the Dragon". I am very glad you all enjoy it for what it is. I'm happy to say that work is going well on the final cut of Into the Fire, and it will be released this coming week.

Cheers!

 

[Neglify]

Why so much artifacting and color bleeding? Use a better quality image for the poster.

 

[ranger613]

Hi, ok will do. I think I upsized a small picture--will redo this, thanks!

 

[ranger613]

 

[ssj]

noss, ranger of 613 worlds.

is the mp4 going to be in SD or HD @ 720p? if the latter, i recommend something below 4 GB in size. (would also recommend the same for former. )

 

[ranger613]

noss, ranger of 613 worlds.

is the mp4 going to be in SD or HD @ 720p? if the latter, i recommend something below 4 GB in size. (would also recommend the same for former. )

Hi, thank you! It is HD@ 1080p, unless I am mistaken, at 7 GB. That's the version I uploaded.

 

[ssj]

1080p? coolio. should be a damn good-looking mp4, then.

 

[kellenpure]

Really can't wait to watch this RANGER. You work fast - must be some long nights!

 

[ranger613]

1080p? coolio. should be a damn good-looking mp4, then.

Haha to me it plays identical to the source, hopefully looks as good on a big screen. Thanks

Really can't wait to watch this RANGER. You work fast - must be some long nights!

You know it haha!

 

[Moe_Syzlak]

As kellenpure says, you must be putting in some long nights. I don't want to contribute to that but I wondered when this might be ready. I have a home theater in my current house, but am moving in a matter of weeks. Hoping I get to watch this one on the big screen.

 

[Aztek463]

First off...I dug the return of "I See Fire" as the first credits song.

Fire of the Dragon is still my preferred edit, as you said it was yours, but the effort you went to to produce a cut closer to the books for those who wanted one are certainly noted!

I liked the new intro, though I did find the fade to black a bit odd where the eagles are implied to drop off their passengers. I would have considered having the title fade in as the shot was fading out, if only to give the fade to black another reason for being there.

The river chase was well cut together as well. Definitely reminded me of Kerr's version of the escape from Goblin Town in AUJ (I need to watch that edit again, actually!) I loved how the scene outside of the door was done as well. I always did find it a little odd that the dwarves just kind of started to leave when they couldn't get in, but then again, I can't say I would have stuck around for too long!

Great job cutting the dwarves from ever entering Erebor! Now, I wonder if when Smaug takes off if the gold he shakes off is just supposed to be coins and bits of treasure that stuck to him while he was slumbering? That's how I chose to interpret it, anyways, but it does create a (slight) continuity error that in one shot he's...just scaly and the next he's all blinged out. But since it's a fairly small thing (not to mention a fantastically pretty shot no matter how you slice it) and you achieved your goal, it's pretty good. Excellent, I'll say. Not my preferred cut, as I said, but for what you aimed to achieve, you nailed it.

Also, many thanks for the mention at the end!

Speaking of the end, and I just double checked Fire of the Dragon...what exactly did you do to the scrolling credits at the end? Well, not more what, but why? Not that it matters at all, since it doesn't affect the main narrative. Just curious.

So, [MENTION=10544]ranger613[/MENTION]...when was the last time you slept?

 

[ssj]

ranger who dispatched 612 others, i do anticipate your edit with great anticipatory anticipation.

 

[ranger613]

First off...I dug the return of "I See Fire" as the first credits song.

Fire of the Dragon is still my preferred edit, as you said it was yours, but the effort you went to to produce a cut closer to the books for those who wanted one are certainly noted!

I liked the new intro, though I did find the fade to black a bit odd where the eagles are implied to drop off their passengers. I would have considered having the title fade in as the shot was fading out, if only to give the fade to black another reason for being there.

The river chase was well cut together as well. Definitely reminded me of Kerr's version of the escape from Goblin Town in AUJ (I need to watch that edit again, actually!) I loved how the scene outside of the door was done as well. I always did find it a little odd that the dwarves just kind of started to leave when they couldn't get in, but then again, I can't say I would have stuck around for too long!

Great job cutting the dwarves from ever entering Erebor! Now, I wonder if when Smaug takes off if the gold he shakes off is just supposed to be coins and bits of treasure that stuck to him while he was slumbering? That's how I chose to interpret it, anyways, but it does create a (slight) continuity error that in one shot he's...just scaly and the next he's all blinged out. But since it's a fairly small thing (not to mention a fantastically pretty shot no matter how you slice it) and you achieved your goal, it's pretty good. Excellent, I'll say. Not my preferred cut, as I said, but for what you aimed to achieve, you nailed it.

Also, many thanks for the mention at the end!

Speaking of the end, and I just double checked Fire of the Dragon...what exactly did you do to the scrolling credits at the end? Well, not more what, but why? Not that it matters at all, since it doesn't affect the main narrative. Just curious.

So, ranger613...when was the last time you slept?

Thanks for the review my friend! Yeah the title over the fadeout is a great idea--I should have done this and I will for the final cut. Otherwise, I'm glad you agree the film works well. The dragon in the end lol I thought the same thing, what is it was just some treasure stuck on, or the dust from being cooped up for years in what was essentially a cavern. In any case, I color corrected it to make it less noticeable (in the original the gold really stood out, more so than it does here), and cut away at strategic points.

I sleep every night believe it or not haha--its just that I did these 4 edits over a long period of time, and did not advertise them until close to completion (the other three are Sorceror, Blade runner and Walking Dead). I make changes, queue up my workload and let my media encoder render while I sleep haha.

And the mention-- dude are you kidding me? Totally man, you've been a huge part of why these edits are even passable. I really appreciate the feedback and without it wouldn't even have made these. ;-) Cheers bro

ranger who dispatched 612 others, i do anticipate your edit with great anticipatory anticipation.

Haha absolutely! I PM'd you Hope you enjoy

 

[Moe_Syzlak]

When I watched your FotD cut, I watched the ending with an eye towards removing the molten gold and I thought you could cut to after where Smaug has shaked off the gold. You'd lise the dramtic exit from the mountain, though. I guess it comes diwn to whether that dramtic scene is more important than the continuity. I obviously haven't seen how you've handled it in this edit yet though.

 

[ranger613]

When I watched your FotD cut, I watched the ending with an eye towards removing the molten gold and I thought you could cut to after where Smaug has shaked off the gold. You'd lise the dramtic exit from the mountain, though. I guess it comes diwn to whether that dramtic scene is more important than the continuity. I obviously haven't seen how you've handled it in this edit yet though.

I thought of this-- and decided seeing the dragon come out at least would be good. So I colored scene to make the gold as dim as possible while retaining night background detail, and cut away at the right points when the gold was too obvious

 

[Moe_Syzlak]

Fantastic! Two small quibbles:

1. I would move the dwarf scene that starts at 1:26:27 to 1:29:42. You can see fire in the doorway and this would also make it not seem so much like Thorin was going to just let Bilbo die since Smaug then flies out so quickly after.

2. And I still think the spin that Smaug does to rid himself of the gold needs to go. He can still fly out of the mountain but cut from 1:31:05-1:31:13.

I also agree with whoever said to put the title in the fade to black, but it seems you've already decided to do that.

Overall, I think this cut works perfectly. I like a less action heavy middle chapter in a trilogy. It doesn't seem at all rushed to me either. Great job!

 

[ranger613]

[MENTION=13347]Moe_Syzlak[/MENTION], Thank you very much! I'm glad this edit works for you, and narrative-wise it reminds me of the original novel that I love so much.

On your points, the dwarf idea is brilliant, an oversight on my part, that's the perfect place to move it to, also gives ample time for Bilbo to run to the great hall. Plus, it solves an audio problem I had with that segment.

The titles over the fade-out like [MENTION=4575]Aztek463[/MENTION] said is a great idea.

The dragon---argh, I tried trimming like you're suggesting but without the launch it looks choppy.
[breakout---dwarves----launch/spin/fly] is what it is now.
My other thought was adding another insert (?dwarves/ bilbo?)
so it'll be [breakout--dwarves--launch--(insert)--fly] , getting rid of the spin.
It has been bothering me, I'll think of a suitable insert-- Bard?? He's been absent in this cut. Maybe a shot of him looking up. Let me know what you think.

But those are the final polishes to what I hope will be a good "purist" cut of Desolation. Thanks for your help.

One other cut I'm considering is the birds flying underneath Radagasts hat in the high fells-- seemed out of place, I don't know.

Another thing, and Aztek asked me this too, is I don't know if I'll be making Unexpected Journey cuts. I mean the edits out there are good stuff, and if I do something, it has to be closer to Into the Fire--purist edition type thing. It has to be something completely different compared to the excellent versions out there. I fiddled with it in the past, and this is an idea of what I mean by different:

https://rangerkris613.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F89212108698

But we'll see. In the mean time, I'm really happy you like this cut!
CHeers

 

[kellenpure]

Honestly, Menbailee's UJ is a pretty tight book cut. Between his and the Arkenstone edition, I think the movie has been pretty nailed as a fanedit. Not to discourage anyone. At some point I will like to see someone edit the three movies into two (or even one). Also, when the extended edition of DofS comes out, an edit pulling any good scenes from that would be cool.

I'm about a third of the way through into the fire and will have feedback soon. So far it's great, other than jumping from the eagles to Bilbo spying seems abrupt. Maybe show at least a couple eagles dropping them off then cut to Bilbo?

So far I love how Fili (or Kili, who cares) has been minimized. The arrow in leg crawl to the river gate thing gone thank the gods! The movie is about Bilbo, not a punky little wanta-be dwarf with no beard to speak of. Man PJ caved to make a handsome character for the young ladies to gawk at. Anyway, less Kili (or Fili) is a good thing.

 

[kellenpure]

Finished up Into the Fire tonight. BY MY BEARD, what an outstanding edit! I don't know how you can crop the crap out of a movie and make everything so seamless.
*Elves - right on, literally. The weakest love triangle in movie history no longer exists, Huzzah!
*Lake Town - This sequence has really grown on me, particularly without the orcs and elves. Bard searching for a tapestry with Thorin on it always seemed odd to me, maybe the only part where I go "eh". He doesn't seem like a fellow who would spend much time in a tapestry shop, and what a strange tapestry to have in Lake Town. Maybe no other way for Bard to get the lightbulb on, I don't know.
*Dwarves finding keyhole - outstanding. Perfect cuts, totally works in my opinion. Dwarves discouraged but not complete crybabies.
*Gandalf - love the guy, and all the scenes. Radagast bearable, even bird under hat thing.
*Smaug - just Bilbo and the dragon. Such an epic cut! It should be no other way. The majesty of the dragon is maintained by not having a goofy dwarf chase. And in this case, yes I'm a homer for the book version. It is about BILBO! But I am going to throw this out there for others to comment on - I don't like Smaug mentioning "there is another darkness coming". He is a stand alone villain, yet this line makes it seem like he is in league with Sauron. Just not the case as per the book. I'd like to see it gone, as well as the clip of the orcs going off to war. Don't need that foreshadowing. And finally, Smaug really is too golden when he flies out of Erebor. Is there any way to darken the scene to the point of just a silhouette? Pieces flying off is fine, just need to get rid of the color.

Minor comments at best. You're my hero man. I have been waiting for someone to save this movie and you pulled it off. THanks!

 

[ranger613]

Finished up Into the Fire tonight. BY MY BEARD, what an outstanding edit! I don't know how you can crop the crap out of a movie and make everything so seamless.
*Elves - right on, literally. The weakest love triangle in movie history no longer exists, Huzzah!
*Lake Town - This sequence has really grown on me, particularly without the orcs and elves. Bard searching for a tapestry with Thorin on it always seemed odd to me, maybe the only part where I go "eh". He doesn't seem like a fellow who would spend much time in a tapestry shop, and what a strange tapestry to have in Lake Town. Maybe no other way for Bard to get the lightbulb on, I don't know.
*Dwarves finding keyhole - outstanding. Perfect cuts, totally works in my opinion. Dwarves discouraged but not complete crybabies.
*Gandalf - love the guy, and all the scenes. Radagast bearable, even bird under hat thing.
*Smaug - just Bilbo and the dragon. Such an epic cut! It should be no other way. The majesty of the dragon is maintained by not having a goofy dwarf chase. And in this case, yes I'm a homer for the book version. It is about BILBO! But I am going to throw this out there for others to comment on - I don't like Smaug mentioning "there is another darkness coming". He is a stand alone villain, yet this line makes it seem like he is in league with Sauron. Just not the case as per the book. I'd like to see it gone, as well as the clip of the orcs going off to war. Don't need that foreshadowing. And finally, Smaug really is too golden when he flies out of Erebor. Is there any way to darken the scene to the point of just a silhouette? Pieces flying off is fine, just need to get rid of the color.

Minor comments at best. You're my hero man. I have been waiting for someone to save this movie and you pulled it off. THanks!

Kellenpure, thank you very much. I truly appreciate the kind words man. I am very glad you enjoy this edit, and will make the few minor changes (based on common problems I see on the thread) before releasing the final cut.

The biggest problem is the dragon--I'll continue to experiment and post regular clips to see if it gets better.

That's a good point-- the "Darkness is coming" thing diverts from the scene a bit too much--like how could Smaug possibly know that if he's been hibernating for so long. Morse code by the thrush maybe? I want to cut this--I prefer Gandalf's fate to be a mystery until the third movie too. What does everyone else think?

Once again my thanks. I couldn't have done this without you guys' pointers.